Lease pricing, how much do you pay? - Page 6 - Lincoln MKC Forum
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post #51 of 61 Old 02-07-2018, 09:42 PM
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I pick my 2017 MKC 2.3L AWD white tricolor up on 2/10/18...43,355 MSRP, got it for $35,828 plus title, taxes and tags. 8k off..haggled hard to get that deal...and did I mention I got 0 percent for 72months? yes they wanted to move a left over 2017 but I am happy as a clam...local dealer would not deal...2 others were $1500 different and then a 4th working with Costco pricing quoted so far out of the 2 I was dealing with, he ended up way out in left field. I got the best deal on the car with options I wanted....I have never worked so hard on any deal for a vehicle and I have bought a lot. My advise is shop around and be prepared to drive to get the one you want. I have to drive 2 hours to get it but saved $2500...it was worth it...worked the deal on the internet, emails and phone calls. Happy hunting with the dealers...some will deal...some will not..you have to find the one that will and usually its the dealership that sells a lot and wants to keep that bonus check from Lincoln coming in based on the units they sell.
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post #52 of 61 Old 03-03-2018, 04:09 PM
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Wait till you arrive to sign the papers before you claim total victory! but good work and a well valued purchase. I am actually quite fond of the 2015-2017 looks and think they were on to something they could have stuck with across the board but.....

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post #53 of 61 Old 07-31-2018, 02:42 PM
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No I don't work for this CU but i have been a member in the past. Based on this info I'll be a member again in about 30 days. They will buy your loan from someone else for 3% off what you are paying, with the lowest rate they will give is 1.75%. I called and they want you to have held your loan for at least 6 months. I just bought this car last week, I called them and since they would like my business back they said when I get my pmt book they will convert. My 36 month note currently at 3.99% will go to 1.75%. I'll take my son there next week to get his converted on his Focus. I hope someone else can use this info.

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post #54 of 61 Old 08-01-2018, 08:55 AM
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chiming in on an older thread but I'm happy with our deal. Wife's car stickered for just over $49k, we paid somewhere in the area of $45k (don't have all the paperwork in front of me) and did a 36mo 12k/yr with ZERO down for $496/mo. That's a good deal and vs a buy way better in the long run. I've seen some posts about the debate between buying and leasing and having worked and grown up in my family's dealerships, I'd be happy to cover any questions. Overall, on new cars, leasing tends to work out best for most if they are disciplined in saving money.

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post #55 of 61 Old 08-01-2018, 09:42 AM
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Originally Posted by bobandsherry View Post
Every loan vs lease option needs to be analyzed on it's own costs. I've bought and leased cars based on expected cost of ownership.
Agree 100%. Below is how it works out too.

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Originally Posted by ddsski View Post
Was quite shocked at MKC quality, looks, and esp as a racer the way it drove thru the twisties on par with my X5's ! Was ready to buy a 2017 Reserve ~47000 (my deal would have been ~42000) when I saw a loaded 2015 MKC (identical car) on lot with 17500 on odometer. Why pay $42000 when I can walk out door for $29200+ tax ( btw much less due to trade in associated with the deal-> forgot to throw that into my pricing so take another grand off your deal) with a 3 yr note at 2.34% =$496.30/month. So except for the Ecoboost badge on mine v a 2017, 99.99% of the public thinks your car and mine are identical yet even with your numbers, I'm at or ahead of you, can do what I want to vehicle and as a bonus, will have an asset at trade in time which if I keep it for 5-7yrs may be only $5000, but if I drive it for 3yrs and put 50K on it, will be far closer to 10K in my pocket. while you are at ZERO.
I think your overall point stands but then you bought a 2yr old vehicle with 17k on the clock vs a new car with zero on the clock. Yes, buy vs lease, buying used and keeping forever is always better than buying new. However, one of the big advantages of leasing is driving the most current vehicles during the best years/miles of it's life. aka no sloppy seconds.

As a side note, you can do whatever you want to the the car you own but you're not really that limited on a lease either so long as you restore the vehicle to the original turn-in condition and don't do anything to permanently void the warranty that remains. Not sure what you were looking to do the car but just clarifying that leasing doesn't preclude you for modifying the vehicle.

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Otherwise you lease it if you can't afford the extra upfront costs to achieve ownership that first time, which, in turn, allows you to climb the ladder with vehicles by always having a trade in to use as your downpayment.
There's far more to why one would lease vs buy than up-front costs. Even there, upfront costs and day-forward costs associated with a lease are often LESS than on buys. Clearly on your deal you put money down in the form of trade equity. On a lease, that's a bad financial move as the idea of leasing it to keep your equity/cash in YOUR Pocket not in the vehicle or in the accounts of the financing company.

In your case at $29,200 for 36 months at 2.34% the rate was fine. However with Zero down the payment would have been around $840mo (I didn't include tax on your sale either) but don't need to in order to show the point. Now to get down to $496mo you obviously used trade equity and/or cash to get the payment down do that amount. Simple math shows it was about $12,000. Not sure if you wanted to do that but for me, I would much rather have that $12k in MY Back Account or investment making me money vs in my car which is simply a depreciating asset. My point is if you can't afford the $840mo payment without the money down then you're buying too expensive of vehicle. Not direct at you mind you, just a point that I'm making.


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Even if you finance 50K everytime you get a new vehicle, every time you have a 10-20K trade in, you can buy that much more vehicle and have no negative effects on your ownership costs, or if you have reached that self-determined pinnacle, your ownership costs go down by 10-20K each vehicle.
Putting equity down to reduce a payment, especially in today's economy, isn't a good move. You can do far better financially taking $10-20k in equity and investing it. You'll far out-earn the cost of interest on the car loan.

We can continue the discussion using our $49k NEW 2018 lease vs your buy since we already know those numbers. You bought used, put a lot of money down and even if you pay the vehicle off after 3 yrs and own it, you can still calculate a monthly cost of ownership. Let's see what that looks like by ffwd to the end of my lease and the month you make your last payment and now OWN it.

I just spend 36 months in a $49k vehicle paying more or less $500mo with ZERO down and am now moving out into a new Lincoln. In fairness I can actually do that in 33 months as the terms of our Lease allow me to move out 3 months early with ZERO payments remaining if I lease another Lincoln. Really makes no difference as my cost-to-drive is still only $500 mo.

Your cost to drive per month however is far more as you have to factor in the $12k you put down. Doing that your cost to drive for 36 months is still that $830mo. That's 36 x your $496mo payment plus the $12k down divided out over 36 months. Now you do have the advantage of having "equity" in the vehicle you now own. Congrats in a sense but condolences in another. I'll let you plug in a number of what a now 5yr old MKC is worth but my guess is it's somewhere in the $10-12k range. Sounds good as you have hopefully recouped your down payment equity but it's sitting in a vehicle that you can only access when you sell or trade it and hasn't earned anything for you since you used it day-one.

Now look at what I have been doing....I'm paying the same $500mo but saving the $330mo difference. I won't even factor in the earnings of that money, thus after 36 months of saving I too have "equity" in the amount of $330x36= $11,800 only in my case it's not tied up in a depreciating asset exposed to damage and harm and is not a variable amount at the mercy of what a dealer will give me for it or what it might sell for. I've also been earning that money since month one.
I trust the above is easy enough to follow.

The big difference however is that I drove a NEW car with 6 miles on it and our car stickered for $49k and was only missing the THX System whereas yours wasn't likely nearly as feature rich and was used with 17k on the ODO. In order for you to really realize a bigger benefit you'll have to stay in your now 5yr old likely 60k miles SUV for several more years. Nothing wrong with that mind you but the cost delta in terms of savings isn't worth it to me or my wife.


Financing yeilds higher payments up-front for the sake of acruing equity in the vehicle whereas leasing costs less up-front allowing the driver to save the difference in buy vs lease payments in their own bank account or investment. Leasing allows that accrual of said equity from day one too vs on a buy many people are upside down on a car until about 42 months into a 60 month financing plan. Sure that can be mitigated with money down at the point of sale, but I've already proven that doing so isn't the best move.

Cliffs: Leasing a fully loaded NEW $49k MK-C with ZERO Down is still more cost effective than buying a 2yr old one with less features for $29k even if you put $12k down.
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post #56 of 61 Old 08-01-2018, 10:35 AM
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Originally Posted by ddsski View Post
Now the tables turn. My mileage is unlimited and hold true whether I drive 5000 or 50000 miles/yr. Obviously if its very low mileage, car is worth A LOT MORE at resale time which will further erode your savings.

leasing doesn't limit anyone on mileage. vehicles depreciate the same in terms of how many miles one puts on them regardless of whether it's leased or financed or paid for up-front. Yes, vehicles are worth more with low miles but on a lease that savings is realized up-front in the form of 1-3% of MSRP when the residual is calculated. any overage is really a moot-point as it only comes into play if the lessee turns the car in. Most will not if they are savvy as just simply trade it in on their next deal in which the trade value becomes negotiable and thus any mileage in the area of say 5k overage is likely going to be dismissed. Even at worse case, mileage is simply charged at $.20 per mile which is only a $.05 overage vs when buying them up-front whereby you can buy them for $.15 per. If you're a business traveler it's often way more advantagous to just buy them up front as the current mileage reimbursement is $.535 per.


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I can do whatever I want to the vehicle, say upgrade premium sound to superior sound, tune the motor, etc. You are stuck for 3 yrs with a potential lemon or vehicle that has a quirk you hate. I can unload trouble in a yr (take my lumps of course)

You can still upgrade any audio if you wish; just restore it to stock in the event you decide to turn it in. Otherwise, again, on trade it won't matter. Tuning the motor.....do a piggy back vs tune. No sense in voiding a warranty if you don't need to. Besides, who on an MK-C is tuning the car? Not many. In terms of "being stuck" that's not true. There's no difference in terms of how lemons are handled but if you're referencing selling or trading early, do the math on a lease vs buy. A finance or buy will screw you much more than exiting a lease as the lease has less of a commitment dollar wise. All it is in the remainder of payments which is about 50% of the MSRP vs a buy where it's the cost of the entire loan. YMMV but one of the advantages of leasing is the commitment both time and dollar wise is far less. The "lumps" will be less on a lease in most cases.

Quote:
I'm at or ahead of you, can do what I want to vehicle and as a bonus, will have an asset at trade in time which if I keep it for 5-7yrs may be only $5000, but if I drive it for 3yrs and put 50K on it, will be far closer to 10K in my pocket. while you are at ZERO.

Again, incorrect. Lease vs buy, yes, you will have a a depreciating asset at the end of the loan but so will a person who leases.....only their equity will be in the form of money saved from day-one vs having it tied up in a depreciating asset that is unacceptable until it's sold or traded. You paid $500 but lost access to your $12k down payment the day you bought it. No thanks, I would have kept that $12k. You used it to get to a $496mo payment, whereas I didn't put anythign down and got he same $500mo lease on a much nicer and newer vehicle and that $12k.....I just simply have to save my difference in lease vs buy ($330mo) and I will have it at the end of 3yrs just the same.



Quote:
Good debate. nothing personal. I just love to hold my titles and sell my unusual purchases on my own for lots of extra $$$.

Agree only whereas you like to hold titles, I prefer to hold onto my money in the form of money, savings or investments thus having that extra $$$ accessible up-front day one.

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post #57 of 61 Old 08-02-2018, 08:52 AM
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I'm a little off topic on an old thread but...
my 2 cents: Do your math and then decide.
Example if you buy at $45k and in two years it can be sold for $25k. That is a difference of $20k divided by 24 months equal $833 a month. You also need to calculate in tax paid on full purchase vs. tax for lease purchases. (that math I can't do for you since state to state is different) So that is your line to decide if you solely go by the numbers.

Things to keep in mind:
Negotiate Negotiate Negotiate. Most people don't negotiate their lease.
Don't lease beyond the bumper to bumper warranty. -- the last thing you want to do is put in a few thousand in an unexpected repair two months before trade in.
Try to put Zero down and get GAP insurance. If it gets totaled two months after leasing it. Your hefty down payment is vaporized with the accident.
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post #58 of 61 Old 11-08-2018, 11:19 PM
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I bought a new 4Runner Ltd 18 months ago. Paid cash. ONLY had 3500 miles on it so I decided to cash out and sold it.

I was going to buy a used SRX for $20K and bank $16K. After a few days reading the SRX forums and GM's not stepping up to common expensive issues, I decided to put the entire amount from the Toyota in the bank and try for a lease with the tax ($500 max in SC) and first payment down.

I spied a used SRX at a Lincoln dealer but started looking at the 19 Lincolns, I like that it is "understated" and not in your face luxury like Caddy, MB, BMW I also looked at RDX, and NX but their dealerships were 100 miles away. I am also leery of US brands reliability so I was not going to pay a whole lot to drive or own it. I used up about $6000 in equity on the 4Runner so that cost me $428 a month to own.

I started talking 7500-mile lease. Found an MKC Reserve I liked because it had the THX option. But it was listed at $45900 I could not see how I could get a no down sub $400 lease on it.

I wanted a payment under $400 with no down on a $46K sticker. Well They kept pulling rebates out of their asses, Military, Competitor, College and anything else they dug up to make the deal work. I was adamant about not paying a penny over $399.

At the end of the day I got retail for my 4Runner lowering my cost to drive it by selling it myself banking the full amount and acquired a lease payment of $399 x36 for my MKC For all I know about Lincolns, I may Have paid too much....LOL

As an aside, the sales guy I had was extremely knowledgeable about every feature and button. We spent an hour just going over all the option, switches and lamps. Auto parking was cool but I don't think I will need that. Not many salespeople have the inclination to learn the product inside and out. Maybe that's a "Lincoln" thing. I was impressed.

I will be calling back to ask what's with the red LEDs on the dashboard under the windshield

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post #59 of 61 Old 11-08-2018, 11:44 PM
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Another advantage of leasing:

If I hit or get hit, by another vehicle or hail storms, I won't eat the bad Carfax and lower trade or sale.

If I get into a serious at-fault accident, the leasing company gets sued as well. They are the owners and have deep pockets, although we still buy a 2 mil umbrella.

I can decide to turn it in and buy another brand or keep it. I still have the vehicle priced at the discounted cap reduced lease price.

Our sales taxes are capped at $500 per vehicle. I'm exempt from the property tax as well. No way would I go through cars if we had % sales tax.

I am far less OCD about leased vehicles than those I paid for.

I would rather pay for only the depreciation with well a ton of options than buy without any options, but then again I don't keep my vehicles over the long term, Three years is a long time for me to hold on to a vehicle.

Leasing may not be financially better than buying used and paying it off. But if one has the income, the lease payment is not felt much. We paid off our home in 15 years so the leases are our only payments. Everything else is cash and carry.

I have earned the right to buy a new car every three years, or two no matter how incorrect financially. I am 64 years old. I am through with my saving every penny. I am in the spending mode and still cannot spend our income, nevermind savings. So I piss away money on cars LOL I still like the game. Negotiating. Selling my own cars.

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post #60 of 61 Old 11-09-2018, 02:11 AM
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Originally Posted by SubVette View Post
I will be calling back to ask what's with the red LEDs on the dashboard under the windshield
It's crash avoidance warning. Mine lights up frequently with turning cars in front of me. Separate note: you might have auto breaking on it.. I think 2019 has it.
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